YYG Site Terms Preview

An anonymous user from Europe writes to tell us of the possible changes in the new terms of use policy. Although the terms and conditions are by no means final,  here is a compact summary of the current version:

In plain English, some of the [leaked] terms outline how users are waiving some of their rights to the game and giving them to YoYo Games when the game is submitted and uploaded to their site. Essentially YYG would have rights to use a submitted game in most cases, however it wants. They are even able to request that it is modified to their liking, and if you can believe it, possibly even sell your game! It appears as though this wouldn’t require any permission on your part, although it is unlikley YYG would do this without your permission.

In summary, unless you want to give many of your rights to your creations up to YoYo Games and let them benefit from using the game everywhere, changing it, and possibly even making money from it… you may want to choose an alternative site to host your games.

Opinions?

Note 1: The source of this news cannot be confirmed as the user was anonymous. However, a moderator later confirmed that the terms that are being referred to in this article are genuine [ see comment below ].

Note 2: The terms and conditions have many similarities to the terms found here http://www.perplexcity.com/about/terms/. This may either indicate YoYo Games is planning to base their license off of this current one.

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14 Responses to “YYG Site Terms Preview”

  1. Waffle Says:

    The source of this news *has been confirmed*.

    From http://gmc.yoyogames.com/index.php?showtopic=292319&view=findpost&p=2042661 : “I don’t know who sent a copy of the Terms & Conditions to PythonPoole about this, but nothing has been set in stone yet. It was irresponsible for whoever shared that with him to do so, and it was idiotic for him to post anything about it.”

    It’s quite clear that these are genuine excerpts from the T&C under discussion. Please move this article back to GMNews.

  2. gmnews Says:

    Thank you Waffle, I appreciate your contribution to this website. I hope everyone understands that I had an obligation to send the email over of the anonymous user who sent me this information when the Administrator of the website being implicated in the article personally emailed me and requested it from me.

  3. Waffle Says:

    No, you did not. You had no moral or legal obligation of any sort to do so, and I challenge you to show otherwise.

    You did, however, have a moral obligation to your source to keep his anonymous and confidential contribution in confidence.

  4. gmnews Says:

    If I hadn’t complied with the request there are many possible situations that could have occurred.

    – Yo Yo Games and its staff could have demanded I release any information I had about the source of the news or threaten to take legal action against myself for illegally obtaining and publicizing confidential, access controlled information without permission.
    – Yo Yo Games and its staff could have demanded I release any information I had about the source of the news or threaten to internal action (eg banning, privilage reduction, etc)
    – Not complying to the request would result in strong negative PR towards Scorptek, and an attempt to shutdown this news site could have been made.

    If you read the Scorptek Privacy Policy,
    (http://www.scorptek.org/home/?a=privacy)

    You will see this paragraph:
    Disclosure
    Unless noted otherwise, Scorptek does not sell, rent or otherwise distribute or make available any personal information to third parties. Exceptions: Personal information may, as required, be given to

    * government or statutory authorities
    * organizations which are outsourced to provide a specific service to Scorptek
    * Trusted organizations Scorptek has an affiliation with who need to identify a particular user because of a crime, legal offense or rule breaking he or she is the primary suspect for

    Clearly, this situation falls into the third category.

  5. Waffle Says:

    There’s no law against publicising information. You didn’t sign an NDA; if someone else broke theirs, that’s their problem. Certainly, it’s possible that *if* there was a lawsuit pending, you might subject to a court order demanding that you reveal your source, but that hasn’t happened yet.

    Which is beside the point – if you feared it had been obtained illegally, why did you post it?

    Nobody twisted your arm. You’re attempting to sell someone else out to escape from a situation you created. Go ahead and tell me that isn’t negative publicity for Scorptek.

    The bottom line is: Either be preparted to protect your sources, or don’t post. You can’t have your cake and eat it too.

  6. Flashback Says:

    You’ll note that, from the description given in the article, this is nothing new. Look at the 64digits TOS – you give certain redistribution rights to 64digits, as well as other modification rights and the ability to use it in a promotional capacity.

    I really wish that people would stop trying to twist everything YoYoGames does into something sinister.

  7. msr Says:

    what’s the point of having a rumors website if you are going to send information about the people who provide you the rumors? This might as well close right now, since no one is going to trust you with any interesting information.

  8. gmnews Says:

    Please keep on topic. I was asked by the administration of the website directly involved in this ordeal to provide the email which had been sent to me. Under Scorptek policy, if Scorptek is asked to identify a user who is a primary suspect to possible illegal activity or a rule breaking (including leaking information out to the public which was not intended for anyone to see) on an affiliated site, Scorptek staff must comply. I did forward the email to the appropriate authorities, however I do not believe there is any action being taken. I’d also like to add the user was anonymous in the email, and I didn’t (and couldn’t) give any information relating to the anonymous person’s username or real name.

  9. Waffle Says:

    Stop trying to dodge the issue. Why did you post if you had no intention of protecting your anonymous source?

    That’s how it works. People tell you things in confidence, you keep that confidence or you don’t use the thing they tell you. That’s the deal. You don’t take what they gave you and then betray them anyway.

    The simple principle of not cheating people is pretty universal and takes precedent over whatever policy you’ve written for yourself. Msr is quite right, anyone with useful information for your new site will now know better than to trust you with it.

    For that matter, why is this article still here? You said articles would be moved to GMNews when they were confirmed; this article has been confirmed (it says so in the article itself); yet it is still on the rumours page. Why is that, exactly?

    Is the answer to both questions just that you’re a huge coward motivated by your craven fear that someone (GMC moderators, Yoyogames, the Welsh) will be angry with you if you stand up for your sources or your readers and show some backbone?

    Hiding behind ‘company policy’ as though you’re part of a large organisation and not some guy making rules for himself isn’t fooling anyone, least of all your readers.

  10. gmnews Says:

    It is still here because the terms have not been finalized and this is only a draft / speculation on what is to come. While there is confirmation these were the terms at some point, they have most likely changed since then.

    We appreciate your concern Waffle and we will be looking into putting more secure measures into our site policies which prevent this from happening again in the future.

  11. Waffle Says:

    Flashback wrote:
    “You’ll note that, from the description given in the article, this is nothing new. Look at the 64digits TOS – you give certain redistribution rights to 64digits, as well as other modification rights and the ability to use it in a promotional capacity.”

    If that’s all the TOS said there would be nothing sinister or legally dubious about it; that’s perfectly standard for a site that uses user-uploaded content.

    Unfortunately that isn’t what it says.

    “you grant to YoYo Games the non-exclusive, irrevocable, worldwide, perpetual, royalty free right and licence to use your Game for all purposes and in all media and to give all other consents (if any) which YoYo Games requires including under copyright and other intellectual property, data protection and privacy laws world wide, for all and any use of my Game;

    […]

    you waive any so called moral rights and any right to equitable remuneration for the purposes of any rental or lending rights that may be deemed to be in existence in relation to any Game, so that YoYo Games may use your Games in any way it deems fit;

    […]

    it may not be possible to give a credit in relation to your Games.”

    Apparently this contract waives all rights. Yoyogames can edit the game any way they like, they can sell it, and they don’t even have to put your name on it. They can pass it off as their own work.

    Pythonpoole’s claim that ‘it is unlikely that [YYG would exercise these rights]’ is laughable. If your bank hands you a contract saying that the manager can take your money and spend it on beer and hookers, would ‘he probably won’t, though’ make you any more likely to sign it?

    Honestly, if you’re going to have that level of trust why bother with contracts at all, why not have YYG and their users just trust one another not to sue?

  12. Phazon Yoshi Says:

    One question.
    Is taht JUST for putting it on their site, or with the software anyway?

  13. Jinxtengu Says:

    I was Pointing this out long before this so called “leak”

    YoYo games Must be Boycotted at all costs. I would even encourage Hackers to cripple the sites functionality with denial of service attacks.

  14. Nailog Says:

    Their terms of service are written right here …

    http://www.yoyogames.com/terms

    People might bother listening to what you have to say if you stopped acting like an obnoxious troll.


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